Fr. Josef Bisig Claims that Archbishop Lefebvre was a Private Sedevacantist; Kept Position Under Raps So as Not to "Scandalize" his SSPX Priests. See Gloria.tv Report here.
“The See of Peter and the posts of authority in Rome being occupied by antichrists, the destruction of the Kingdom of Our Lord is being rapidly carried out even within His Mystical Body here below (…) This is what has brought down upon our heads persecution by the Rome of the antichrists.” (Letter to the future bishops, 29 August 1987)
Dr. Chojnowski: As you can see from this video and the interview with Fr. Bisig, the Fraternity of St. Peter is exactly how Fr. Poisson portrayed it in the interview published on this website. He sees himself as part and parcel of the Novus Ordo church and urges us to join. Time for another quote by Archbishop Lefebvre:
“To whatever extent pope, bishops, priests or faithful adhere to this new Church, they separate themselves from the Catholic Church.” (July 29, 1976, Reflections on the Suspension a divinis)
If only Archbishop Lefebvre had publicly acknowledged sede vacante then the SSPX would not be where it is today. His inability to have a clear public position is the cause of our woes.ReplyDelete
On a different note it is not the first time we have been told that Archbishop Lefebvre was sedevacantist. As well as that, even his priests acknowledged that he was, at least at times, sedevacantist. Hence Fr Cekada's video: Marcel Lefebvre Sedevacantist. But there was also Archbishop Lefebvre R&R. Only a (real) Pope is infallible.
I have had two independent sources provide me with anecdotal evidence that Archbishop Lefebvre did not regard John Paul II as pope, at least in his later years, so this latest news is not surprising. But it is all too little, too late, and nobody in the SSPX will want to believe it, because by his actions Archbishop Lefebvre ensured the Society would forever be anti-sedevacantist. His Society continues to this day to blacken the names of Nine good priests whom he expelled only a handful of years earlier for believing the same thing as he did later on, and everyone else who comes to the same conclusion. This seems to be the only thing that unifies them. For them to endorse a book written by a (former?) 32 degree freemason, just because it fits in with their rabid anti-sedevacantism, is truly a scandal.ReplyDelete
Behold the legacy of Archbishop Lefebvre.
First and foremost I would not put very much stock in Fr. Bisig's recollections. The SSPX was good enough for him , even the "schismatic " label was ok, when it suited. He and the others who left feigned shock and disappointment at the ordination of the bishops but in reality they wanted the comfortable deal with the Vatican. As far as sedevacantism , the good Archbishop had enough prudence and guidance from the Holy Ghost to stay away from cess pool of thought.ReplyDelete
If you consider yourself a Catholic and those in the Vatican to be Catholic, then you also should be with the Vatican and not opposing its teachings. Or does the label "schismatic" also suit you? The fact that you can call Church teaching a "cess pool of thought" and prefer some other Bishop to the Pope also makes you a schismatic, whether you realize it or not. According to you the Holy Ghost is with Archbishop Lefebvre and has he departed from the Catholic Church? Seems that this is what you are insinuating. He fled the Church into the arms of your Archbishop. None of this is Catholic even if it looks nice and holy. The truth is that Francis is not a Pope and if you were to read both sides of the argument you would see that. But the SSPX tells people "not to go reading on the internet." Hmm....Delete
Were the followers of Athansius schismatic? If so then I gladly would like to be numbered among them. Did Athanasius say " there is no pope"? So were do you, and all sedevacantists, fall in this historic narrative? Sedevacantism is a slothful position adopted by those who have given up. How much easier it is to quit and say there is no pope than to fight and pray. Sedevacantism, as espoused by those who post on this site and every site they carry their ax to grind, is as novel as anything introduced into the Novus Ordo since VCII. .Delete
Anonymous at 6:31 am: Whose side are you on? How can you forget how evil your "Pope" really is; are you suffering from acute amnesia? Here is just one of the dozens of blasphemies that your Satanic "Pope" has recently spewed at Our Lord: He (your Satanic "Pope") said that Our Lord made Himself the *devil* for us. Here's the blasphemous quote for you:Delete
"Jesus made himself the serpent; Jesus made himself sin... and he took the appearance of the father of sin, the cunning serpent...Yes, I carry the cross to show that I am a Christian. And it's fine but not just as a badge.. but rather as the memory of the man who made himself sin, who made himself the *devil*, the serpent, for us; he debased himself up to the point of totally annihilating himself" (April 4, 2017, L'osservatore Romano).
You, Anonymous at 6:31 am, want to be a follower of Satan's Son? Then go ahead, and leave the true Catholics in peace.
I suggest that you read what the catechism, or any other good pre-Vatican II book, has to say about the Church and the Papacy, about indefectibility and infallibility, and also their authority to teach in name of Christ. Any catechism: Baltimore, Catechism of Christian Doctrine, My Catholic Faith, Deharbe... Trent. Bergoglio doesn't fit. That’s just reality. Sedevacantists didn’t make this up, they just follow the teachings of the Church. It is news to me that to believe and uphold what is in the catechism is "slothful".ReplyDelete
And St Athanasius didn’t have any "followers"; if he did he would have told them to submit to the Roman Pontiff, Liberius, because that’s what he did himself. Don’t believe the stories that the SSPX and Michael Davies have peddled all these years, trying to parallel St Athanasius's supposed excommunication by Liberius with Archbishop Lefebvre's excommunication by JP2. There’s no parallel; St Athanasius and Pope Liberius supported one another, and St Athanasius certainly didn’t call Liberius an antichrist. The "Athanasius against the world" quote comes from the emperor rebuking Liberius for refusing to condemn St Athanasius, and standing up for "Athanasius against the world". So the sedevacantists "fall in this historic narrative" by standing for the truth in that Liberius was a holy pope. The SSPX have used Michael Davies' stories to make Liberius a heretic and therefore for it to be normal to have "heretic popes" in order to exonerate Bergoglio, Ratzinger, etc. The Church teaches otherwise. Go back and re-learn your catechism and un-learn the SSPX fables.
"And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it and I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven... " a few sentences later Our Lord says" Get thee behind me, Satan, thou art a scandal unto me: because thou savourest not the things that are of God, but the things that are of men." Jesus called him Satan yet He did not then give the Keys to another or take them back from Peter. When St. Paul rebuked Peter he did not declare him no longer pope. We are on the receiving end of God's anger against us, as St. John Eudes warned, and He has permitted us to fall into the hands of ravening wolves, not shepherds. Instead of " nourishing Christian souls…they drag them to Hell in their train..” This scourge, Vatican II, Pope Francis and all post conciliar popes, are in consequence of sin and disobedience. Our Blessed Mother still waits for Her, and God’s, request to be obeyed. That request being the pope consecrate Russia to Her Immaculate Heart. The princes of the Church have ignored this request or have lied that “ it has been completed”. The Novus Ordo parishioners are not praying for the consecration because they believe it has been done and the sedevacantists believe the time has passed and there is no pope to pray for. “Return O ye revolting children and I will give thee pastors according to My Heart”Delete
To Anonymous at 7:35 am: Were you comparing St. Peter to "Pope" Francis? You quote Our Lord but don't seem to understand His teachings. You are probably a Catholic but may benefit from an explanation of the fundamentals of Catholic dogma: First of all, one of the powers that Our Lord conferred on Peter was that "St. Peter would guarantee to the Church a unity and unshakable strength similar to the rock foundation of a house...The Church was built on Peter. Peter's *faith* was the reason why he was appointed by Christ as the support and foundation of His Church" (Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma, by Dr. Ludwig Ott; 5. The Primacy of St. Peter).Delete
Furthermore, St. Peter loved Our Lord and His Church, so much so, that this holy martyr gave up his life and was crucified head downwards in the circus of Nero on the Vatican Hill. In the future, would you kindly not compare St. Peter to your false pope. Thank you.
Anonymous 1:20. You conveniently avoided the rest of my post after I called VCII, Pope Francis and all post-conciliar popes a scourge on the Church. What about Fatima?Delete
Anonymous at 11:47 AM. As for Fatima, your interpretation of the message is erroneous. Our Lady never said the Faithful should remain united to heretic/apostate "popes". If an apparition were to contradict Sacred Scripture or the fundamentals of Catholic dogma in such a way, then it would be considered a false apparition. Please read Galatians 1: 8-9 and also learn the basics of Catholic dogma.Delete
Anonymous 11:47 am. You put words in Our Lady's mouth. She never said true popes would be a scourge on the Church. By insisting that Francis and the other post conciliar popes are/were Christ's Vicars on earth, you are furtively suggesting that Christ and the Vicar of Christ are a two-headed monster.Delete
What you're preaching is contrary to the Faith. Christ and His Vicar constitute "one only head". Here is what the Church teaches regarding the papacy: "Therefore, of the one and only Church there is one body and one head, not two heads like a monster; that is, Christ and the Vicar of Christ, Peter and the successor of Peter, since the Lord speaking to Peter Himself said: ‘Feed my sheep‘ [Jn 21:17], whence we understand that He entrusted all to him" (Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam).
Please do not project your own pernicious errors onto Our Lady.
Read John Daly, "The Alleged Fall of Pope Liberius" if you can find a copy online.ReplyDelete
"May God console you! ... What saddens you ... is the fact that others have occupied the churches by violence, while during this time you are on the outside. It is a fact that they have the premises – but you have the Apostolic Faith. They can occupy our churches, but they are outside the true Faith. You remain outside the places of worship, but the Faith dwells within you. Let us consider: what is more important, the place or the Faith? The true Faith, obviously. Who has lost and who has won in the struggle – the one who keeps the premises or the one who keeps the Faith? True, the premises are good when the Apostolic Faith is preached there; they are holy if everything takes place there in a holy way ...ReplyDelete
"You are the ones who are happy; you who remain within the Church by your Faith, who hold firmly to the foundations of the Faith which has come down to you from Apostolic Tradition. And if an execrable jealousy has tried to shake it on a number of occasions, it has not succeeded. They are the ones who have broken away from it in the present crisis. No one, ever, will prevail against your Faith, beloved Brothers. And we believe that God will give us our churches back some day.
"Thus, the more violently they try to occupy the places of worship, the more they separate themselves from the Church. They claim that they represent the Church; but in reality, they are the ones who are expelling themselves from it and going astray. Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the true Church of Jesus Christ."
St. Athanasius the Great
The fact that the Church never condemned as schismatic the faithful who refused to go to the churches of the Pax priests of Bohemia because the Pax priests agreed to not condemn communism so they would be left in peace and not arrested, reveals there is a right to withdraw obedience from prelates. In hindsight, Archbishop Lefebvre should have after withdrawing obedience in 1988, followed the jurisdiction of Pope Pius XII only. In hindsight, he should have made a gentleman’s agreement with the original 9, that they leave, found their own society of sedevacantists, and he would ordain their priests and confirm their parishioners. Did any sedevacantist withdraw obedience before 1988? The original 9 didn’t!